CHfather

www.tranceplants.net; www.iamsham.com

Yes to both. RC apparently can lead to psychedelic effects, but at the doses taken to treat CH, it virtually never does. Legal to purchase and possess; just unlawful to process/consume. "Processing" is extremely simple: grind and soak in water. 5-MEO-Dalt is one of Shulgin's compounds. It also has no psychedelic effects (for most people) when taken at effective treatment doses. There are probably many of those compounds that would help treat CH, but this was selected by the guy who did the research -- Mitch Post -- for its low effects plus positive results (for many). As I said, the 5-Meo-Dalt is essentially legal in many US states, and can be legally purchased from some suppliers. (I say "essentially legal" because while it's not explicitly banned in most staes, there is always the possibility that it could be prosecuted as an analog drug.)

Don't want to bug you more about O2 then, Adam', except to say that a higher-flow regulator (higher than 15 lpm) and a bigger reservoir bag have helped a lot of people, particularly with a hyperventilating strategy. Also, downing an energy shot/energy drink right at the start also helps a lot of folks. But I won't pester you about O2. Here's the D3 info (though I now notice that you posted over in the CB Files section, so you clearly know how to get there): https://clusterbusters.org/forums/topic/1308-d3-regimen/ If you can't get shrooms and don't want to do LSD, you could do RC seeds (discussed over there in the CB Files, though you should get back to us if you decide to go that route), and you could consider 5-MEO-Dalt, a synthetic tryptamine that's not illegal in a lot of US states, and which has been very effective for some people. Here's a long thread about it: https://clusterbusters.org/forums/topic/3918-5-meo-dalt/?hl=5-meo-dalt Some people here are knowledgeable about the 5-Meo-Dalt, but it's discussed a lot more over at the Facebook group "Cluster headaches."

Adamlee', please, GET OXYGEN. And think about the Vitamin D3 regimen and busting. That trex ain't good for you. Of course, if you feel like you need it, you need it, and it's better than suffering . . . but there are better options. All those things are discussed over in the ClusterBuster Files section of the board, or if you ask, people will tell you more about them here.

You've got it covered, Suzz. GET OXYGEN. Insist! Do the D3. Try the energy shots/energy drinks. Melatonin at night (start with 6-9 mg and work up. Some people get up to 20 before it's effective). If you get O2 and any of those things help you, you'll feel 100% more comfortable about detoxing from the trex. I assume that one of your preventives is verapamil or another calcium channel blocker, but I can't imagine what the other might be (not a steroid, I hope). Interesting that you were being treated for hemicrania continua. You took indomethacin and it didn't work? It seems like that should have been about a one-week trial . . . If indomethacin doesn't work, it's not HC, which makes it almost certainly CH. You can get rivea corymbosa seeds in Canada legally and possess them legally. Consuming them is the only unlawful part. I think you can also get 5-MEO-Dalt in Canada, but I have not been keeping up with that legal situation. You're really not all that far from busting.

Suzz, there's a lot you need to know. I'm going to cover a few core things and refer you to reading that you really have to do before you start busting. I assume the "injectable" you're talking about is Imitrex (sumatriptan). If you're going to use mushrooms or anything else, you have to stop taking the Imitrex for five days before you take the busting substance, and during the time you're busting. Depending on what your preventive is, you might have to stop taking that, too. So you need something to deal with the attacks during that time. You don't mention having oxygen, which is absolutely critical for anyone with CH. Read this: https://clusterbusters.org/oxygen-information/ Many people also get a lot of relief from the Vitamin D3 regimen. Read this: https://clusterbusters.org/forums/topic/1308-d3-regimen/ There are other things that often help people reduce or abort attacks: energy shots/drinks; melatonin. If you decide to go ahead with this, we'll tell you more about them (well, the energy shot/drink thing is easy -- just down a cold one at the first sign of an attack. strong coffee works for some people, too.) Then, you need to read the numbered files over in the ClusterBuster Files section of the board (same place as where the D3 file is). You'll learn there about the general process (every five days), and you'll see that there are other substances you can use that don't require you to grow shrooms. Many people have good results with LSA -- generally from rivea corymbosa seeds. There's another substance that is like psilocybin but generally legal in most places in the US. It's 5-MEO-Dalt. You can read about it at this thread: https://clusterbusters.org/forums/topic/3918-5-meo-dalt/?hl=5-meo You have had a heck of a rough ride with your chronic CH. Busting works. But it's more than just taking some mushrooms. We're here to help you.

Wish I still lived in Portland, so I could stop in.

Glad for the press! I wonder if we'll see any additional traffic here. You'd think so, but in the past it hasn't really turned out that way. Thanks for participating, Denny!! I think I'd give the article about a C (C minus, for not quoting the interesting and useful stuff you undoubtedly said), but you gotta give the effort and the awareness-building an A. (If only it really worked like that -- one shroom dose (while out drinking!!) and PF after just one more attack.)

We're all about using psilocybin to treat CH here. Read over in the ClusterBuster Files section, #s 1, 2, 3, 4, 6, (https://clusterbusters.org/forums/forum/6-clusterbuster-files/) then ask whatever questions you have. You'll have to stop the triptan, though, and since your cycles are typically so short (can't really count on that continuing), it might or might not be worth it to you. You definitely want to get OXYGEN, as soon as possible. Read about it here. This is crucial for managing your CH. Also, consider the vitamin D3 regimen: https://clusterbusters.org/forums/topic/1308-d3-regimen/ And many people find that quickly drinking an energy shot or energy drink at the first sign of an attack can lessen or even abort an attck.

How close are you to the Airgas store/how convenient will it be for you to get refills? Unless you're a big strong giant like Jeebs or Denny, as spiny says, that 125cf tank is a lot to lug around. It might be more manageable, though probably more expensive (how much more, I don't know) to get two 60s. (At an average 20 lpm flow rate, 125 cu ft will give you just about 3 hours of O2, or about 9 20-minute sessions.)

Many thanks, Bob, for all the ways in which you have helped everyone here and in the worldwide CH community. Your patience and determination are creating benefits for years to come. Jerry

From here, too -- all the best to all the great folks at this site, long-timers and newer members.

Thanks, Tony. Love the pic. Hope you're doing well.

I mentioned this in another post here, but figured it was worth putting here, since it seems like maybe another new thing we might have learned. In the abstract I have pasted below, it says that triptan use is a characteristic of some people for whom oxygen is ineffective. I can't tell how effective the oxygen system used in the study was (flow rate, mask, etc.). What I think is interesting is that we often tell people that oxygen seems to work more effectively during busting. I think we have attributed that to the busting, but it seems possible that maybe (so many ifs and maybes, but you all understand that) it's the detox, being off triptans, that makes the O2 more effective. Or not. Cluster headache and oxygen: is it possible to predict which patients will be relieved? A prospective cross-sectional correlation study. Haane DY1, de Ceuster LM, Geerlings RP, Dirkx TH, Koehler PJ. Author information AbstractResponse to 100 % oxygen as acute treatment for cluster headache is relative low considering certain subgroups or predictors. The primary purpose of the present study was to find prospectively which factors differ between responders and non-responders to oxygen therapy. The second goal was to find whether any of these differences would clarify the mechanism of pain reduction by oxygen and cluster headache pathophysiology. Patients diagnosed with cluster headache according to the ICHD-II criteria, who started on oxygen therapy (n = 193), were recruited from 51 outpatient clinics and via patient websites in The Netherlands. Patients had to return two questionnaires around the start of oxygen therapy (n = 120). Eventually, 94 patients were included. Clear non- plus moderate responders had ever used pizotifen more often (p = 0.03). Clear non-responders more often had photophobia or phonophobia during cluster headache attacks (p = 0.047) and more often had used triptans in the same active phase as the phase in which they had used oxygen for the first time (p = 0.02). Using correction for multiple testing, we could only confirm a statistically significant difference in triptan use. We were unable to locate the level of action of oxygen in the thalamus and cortex or confirm the sites of its action presently known, solely based on current knowledge of photophobia circuits. However, we conclude that particularly the higher frequency of photophobia or phonophobia in clear non-responders deserves further study to understand the mechanism of pain reduction by oxygen and cluster headache pathophysiology.

If you really wanted O2, you could either (a) try to persuade a doc with the substantive medical research; ( find a doc who is not an idiot and who will prescribe it; or © set up an O2 system using welding O2, as many many people have done when (a) and ( failed. If you want information/assistance with any of those possibilities, let us know.

I can't say anything except how very, very sad it makes me to read this. Hoping those meds will mean a manageable cycle that ends quickly. Really sorry.

lbh, If you click on one of the forums -- "General Board," "ClusterBuster Files," etc. -- and then, on the right side of the page, click on "Start A New Topic," you'll see below the new message space a thing to click to upload a file. I guess "Theory and Implementation" would be the most appropriate place to post it, but anywhere will do. Thanks! How's the O2 working for you?

We -- my daughter is the person with CH in my family -- get the whole O2 system home late at night -- and we didn't have the wrench! Luckily, she didn't really believe that O2 was going to help her anyway (as we have discussed), so she wasn't too upset about it. Her joy the next day when it did work was one of the happiest moments of my life.

Thanks. lbh -- and thanks for the citation to that O2 article. If you have access to the full text, I'd love to see it. I confess I had never heard of a "tusk mask." Three notes: (1) All welding O2 tanks take the same type regulator (CGA 540). Medical tanks take different sizes, but the size you have fits on larger medical tanks. (2) At Airgas, you can buy a wheeled cart for moving around your tank, or a stationary stand for it. (3) Great reminder about that wrench! I always forget to tell people that. Unless I'm doing my math wrong, I think you should have almost two hours of O2 at 20 lpm in that 80 cu ft tank.

Yes, it has the nipple (I called it a nipple before -- probably more accurately described as the barbed connector, or something like that. In any event, it comes with the regulator). At some Harbor Freight stores, they also sell O2 tanks. I've never seen anything bigger than a 20 cu ft tank there, and they were sold empty, but you might check.

At www.harborfreight.com, type 94846 into the search bar at the top of the page. Or type oxygen regulator there; they only sell one kind. Check the Store Locator -- they have stores all over the place, and there might be one near you.

Diamondmaker! Great to see your handle here again. Been thinking of you.

All welding tanks take the same type of regulator, a CGA-540. That's the kind that's also used on larger medical tanks, such as M tanks, but not on the smaller medical tanks, such as an E tank. The smaller medical tanks use a CGA 870 regulator. You can of course buy a regulator at the welding place, but (a) they're expensive, and ( they don't have a nipple for attaching the hose for your mask, so you have to buy an adapter. The regulator I linked you to is relatively inexpensive and comes with the adapter. (Welding regulators do not have clickable lpm settings, or even lpm indicators. You have to fool with it a little to get the flow you want, but that's a simple thing to get used to. And the flow will go as high as you want it.)

People use 'em all the time. Be aware that when you go to a welding supply place, you can't ask for tanks according to medical tank sizes ("E" or "M," for example). I believe they're typically sold in 20 cu ft increments. An experienced person once told me that the welding tank equivalent of an M tank is a "Q" tank, and that that is a standard industry designation. I can't vouch for that, but the source is a reliable person.

Tanks purchased from welding supply companies (there has been some talk about getting them at eBay or even amazon, but eBay makes me nervous, and amazon seems to sell only small tanks, expensively). Prices seem to vary very widely. Regulator: http://www.harborfreight.com/oxygen-regulator.html Mask: http://www.clusterheadaches.com/ccp8/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=clustero2kit Of course, you still have to get them in, out, and refilled.