CHfather

Donnie, here's an alternative theory. It is strongly believed here that people should wait about five days between busts, because of a phenomenon called "shutting the door," in which a bust blocks the receptors for about five days so that a dose taken less than five days after a previous dose will have no, or very little, effect. Here's a file about that: http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1290130968 Some people find they can be successful with four days between busts, but your three days (Tuesday-Friday) is probably too little. Can't say that for sure, of course. Wish we could say more for sure. But it's the accumulated experience/wisdom of a lot of folks. So . . . it could be that your Friday dose is actually doing nothing for you because the receptors are still blocked from the Tuesday dose, and your Monday hits are the Tuesday dose wearing off, not the Friday dose wearing off. I think most folks here would recommend trying to get five days between busts, or at least four. Usually, the advice is that if you get extended pain-free time, try to keep stretching out the time between doses. I doubt, personally, that it would just be a matter of taking more on Friday (though I guess you could try that and let us know what happens). In general this isn't like let's say pain meds, where the more you take the more relief you're likely to get. Since the amounts you are taking are generally working, I don't think taking more will work better. Been wrong before; could be again.

jb, i can't say where others are getting them from now, but i know some have gone to http://www.ktbotanicals.com/viable-seeds-c-2.html?page=3&sort=20a and some to http://psychoactiveherbs.com/catalog/index.php?cPath=128&osCsid=32cc08cfa44c2d318bf2b9baa8318933. someone also mentioned recently that they got seeds from tranceplants in about a week, which is better than they were doing before.

Sorry to keep bringing this up, Trace, but did she prescribe oxygen???? If not, heed all the voices here and call her back and ask for it. Sure, the MRI is worth doing. When you say "she put me on verapamil," does that mean you're going to start taking it? Although there is debate about this, it is generally believed to limit the effectiveness of busting though probably not to completely block it. What's the dosage? Also, you might want to take her up on those injections (imitrex, I'm sure). Although they're $2 a pop, you can easily get two or three uses out of each one, and people here have found that they work way past the supposed expiration date. Might be nice to have for a possible future emergency. I can pretty much guarantee you she's not going to look into psilo for treating CH.

some people have used taurine powder or capsules. i guess you could stir the powder into a cup of coffee(???) you're not the first person here to soak first, then pound. since pound first/then soak is supposed to extract practically all of the LSA, it's hard for me to imagine that soak-pound would be stronger. just guessing. very happy about your mask working so well.

What wonderful news. Bless him! Bless you!

Donnie, It's nice to hear you had those five good days! And your new mask should help, too. (Standard procedure is pound first, to a rough powder, then soak for an hour or two.)

Donnie, what's happening with you now? Any improvement?

Just to be clear, Trace, energy drinks and oxygen are methods for aborting (or reducing the severity of) individual CH attacks. Melatonin can be a preventive on a nightly basis, but it will not end your CH cycle or serve as a long-term preventive. Neither will O2 or energy drinks. Busting can actually shorten your cycle and potentially, with maintenance dosing, keep it from coming back (or extend your time between cycles). Small doses of psychedelics are sometimes used to abort attacks, but that's not the main purpose of busting. The D3 regimen and the licorice root method have also worked well for some/many people for ending cycles and avoiding or delaying future cycles. Two different things, abortives and preventives.

it's possible that the red bull won't keep you up. a lot of people find that it doesn't. note that red bull is pretty low in caffeine and taurine compared to some energy drinks, so if it doesn't work, you might try something stronger (some folks here swear by rockstar, which i think is quite high in both). also, the smaller energy shots are easier for some people to get down, and have as much caffeine/taurine as red bull. some folks say the colder the better with the energy drinks. as you'll see. practically everything is personalized in terms of what works and what doesn't. that includes melatonin dosages. some people find they need to go pretty high before they start experiencing results.

You might try drinking an "energy drink" (Monster, RedBull, etc.), or "energy shot" (5-Hour Energy, 6-Hour Power), or even a strong cup of coffee at the start of an attack -- as soon as you feel it coming on. That helps a lot of people. You might also consider starting the D3 regimen (http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1314134804) or licorice root (http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1298659068). And -- A month is way too darn long to wait for oxygen!!!! Are there other clinics in town (you could call first to see if they're familiar with CH and will prescribe oxygen), other doctors . . . a headache clinic anywhere nearby? Virtually everyone here will tell you that oxygen is the first, best line of defense against CH attacks. You can also set up a system without a prescription, using welding oxygen and equipment you can easily buy on the internet (read about that in the oxygen file at the MENU tab on the left). I don't know enough to tell you whether Celexa/Xanax will for sure block busting. But if there's no likelihood of a dangerous interaction, I'd consider trying it. If you don't have easy access to psilo, you might want to order some RC (rivea corymbosa) seeds.

I was able to read the whole thing (it's great -- thanks, Ricardo!) just by doing the free registration. Jerry

very good advice. thank you. my apologies, especially since what i was saying wasn't really relevant anyway (i could link to the online source of my speculation, but that would just be adding to the potential fire).

 it's kind of out of date now, but the blog of dr. richard sewell (psychiatrist at yale med school) contained a number of reports about CH treatments, along with sewell's thoughts about them. www.clusterattack.com  his name is richard andrew sewell, and if you google that in various forms, i think you'll find a bunch of things by him about CH and psychedelics. he was involved with dr. halpern in the early work, which i assume you've seen (e.g., http://www.neurology.org/content/66/12/1920); they had a falling out, as i understand it, over some aspect of halpern's decision to patent bol for use with ch. (maybe sewell falls into the category potter was describing. i can only say that he seems to have tried to keep up the fight, his early work made a big difference, and he was personally very generous with his time with me when i asked for his advice on several occasions.) i'm going far afield now, but it's a curious thing to me that the so-called "anti-inflammatory vitamin d3 regimen" seems to have helped so many people with ch as an effective preventive that also sometimes quickly lessens or even in some cases eliminates CH pain. i have wondered whether that regimen is somehow doing something with brain chemistry, as opposed to just creating a general anti-inflammatory effect in the overall system. (it doesn't help everyone, but there are lots of testimonials, at this site and particularly at clusterheadaches.com). http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1314134804 also relatedly, i have wondered (though some people may already know the answer to this) why some substances that are prescribed for CH interfere with the effects of psychedelics, since (knowing absolutely nothing) i would assume that they do not block the brain receptors affected by psychedelics. you can see a list of some of those meds here: http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1290130731 finally, there was one thoughtful fellow here who undertook to treat his CH with GABA supplements. i know that the GABA mechanism is in the brain and some gaba-related things (such as gabapentin) sometimes help with CH. another possible mechanism???

ub, i think you'll find that what you describe here is pretty much what happened. i don't know that for sure, but from all i've seen, that's what happened. as a non-researcher, i wouldn't characterize it as negatively as you do here. the question was: does this stuff (which as you say has been used before) work? as i recall, clusterbusters financed or partially financed that small open-label trial.

shahooty, every once in a while at this board someone reports on trying to order bol, or have it made for them. the last person, whose screen name i do not remember (and who lived somewhere outside the US), was quite confident that s/he could purchase it. no one has ever come back and reported that they got it, but i don't suppose that necessarily means they didn't. one person, whose screen name i do remember but who hasn't posted here in quite some time, got a couple of shipments of stuff that was supposed to be bol, but which upon testing turned out not to be. this is reflected in ub's concerns about trying to get it on a "black market." in general, as ub says, purchase of bol is restricted to researchers and others with authorization. also, as ub says, some researchers have expressed concerns about possible long-term effects of bol, which have not been fully studied. i assume that the "other options" that ub is talking about are the ones currently used by people at this board -- psilo, lsa, and lsd.

Well, I can tell you that I'm thrilled to see you here, and I'm sure I'm not alone. Right now, you might only be able to imagine somewhat dimly what a breakthrough would mean for one person, let alone for tens and even hundreds of thousands of people with CH. I believe that the person here who has thought the most about the chemistry of CH is probably Ricardo (his screen name). Could be wrong. As I recall, he has had some doubts about the centrality of the 5-HT receptors. There was a time when we discussed some stuff related to this, particularly to the possible role of tumor necrosis factor, at this thread: http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1325136848 And Ricardo also pondered lisuride here: http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1327360561 These might not be doing Ricardo justice. Or maybe some of it will be useful for you. I'm a decent googler. If I can start digging anything out for you, let me know. Jerry

http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1361807077/0#0[quote

 Don't. Most folks just want to get away from it and, as you say, stuff those memories someplace far away.  On the other hand, the voices of folks like you, with experience, can be very valuable to people in similar situations.   Everyone understands that you gotta do what works best for you.

You know, I went to iamshaman.com today for a different reason, and I couldn't find RC (rivea corymbosa) seeds listed at their site. Maybe I just missed it, but I looked in several ways. If they don't have them, and you don't want to chance a slow delivery from tranceplants.net, you might consider www.psychoactiveherbs.com.

?First stanza and last three lines of chorus of ? Â

If your therapeutic idea works, it will henceforth be know as THE (Sorry . . . I saw this today, thought of you of course MG, and just wanted an excuse to post it.)

Are those real questions, Jeffrey? The seeds had a lot of positive effects for you last time, didn't they? Why wouldn't you order quickly and get started? (I don't know where you got your seeds last time, but a caution that tranceplants has been really slow on several shipments in the last few months, so that might not be the best place to go for a quick turnaround.) Hope you don't see this for a long time, or at least long enough to mean that you had no "wake up call" tonight. Â

Dan, I'm sure you encouraged Mr. Passi to come here to meet more people with CH. But I also remember that a frequent poster here, Tony Only, is Finnish and is an administrator of a Facebook CH site that is partly in Finnish. Also, as I recall, Salander (also Finnish) is very active at that site. So he might want to tune in there. This is the URL: https://www.facebook.com/groups/385160354828914/ He could also come here and PM Tony Only or Salander. There was another person from Finland, Panu, who was active here for a while, and of course the wonderful Tingeling is not far away.

Wow, wow!

As so many times before, thank you, shocked. This is really interesting, and hopeful, information.