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Thank you Alleyoop!!! Guess that would be kinda gross with crushed up seeds??


Actually, small doses of "seed tea" is very close to what you mention.  It's called the sip method. Below is a verbatim quote from a German doctor posted some time ago on OUCH UK --

"Hi friends,

have to tell the story of a friend of mine who has been periodic for

meanwhile 16 y (every year having a looooooong six-month bout from

±October/November up to March/April). After few years all

prophylactics stopped working and he was using only O2 as med for

the last couple of years.

Three years ago he started the treatment with Cuban dwarfs with the

white caps, experimenting at different dosages (never tried similar

substances before...), but with a very limited success, on balance a

disappointing therapeutic experience during three bouts.

Then, during the remission in the summer of 2004 he took tea of 2

HBWR seeds three times, i.e. every two months - and for the first

time in 16 y THE BOUT STAYED AWAY, no CH all the winter time

(coincidence? fortuity?)! And, tea of only two seeds didn't have any

hallucinogenic effect. But, in May 2005 very, very slight shadow-

like pains behind the right = CH eye and in the right upper jaw

started to came every second or third day for one or two hours at a

time, but he didn't care and didn't take any more seed tea. Then, in

the very first days of June 2005, a new CH bout started with

vehemence. And, when he started to take the tea, again at the two-

seeds dosage, it didn't help, leave alone the abortion of the

bout...Then, experimenting again, he remained on the following

schedule: Every week of the bout tea of 2 1/2 seeds/day in three

sips evenly distributed over the day, for three consecutive days,

i.e. 7-8 seeds per week. With this dosage of seed tea and

occasionally O2 the entire bout was well manageable and ended in the

beginning of October after four months.

In the beginning of November 2005 a slight pain behind the right eye

and in the upper jaw came again for several hours per day. After a

few days the pain started to get uncomfortable and he took tea of

two seeds - fifteen minutes later the pain disappeared and didn't

resurface so far.

Recipe for one portion of seed tea:

- pound 1 - 2 seeds in a mortar to get a fine powder

- bring a cup or a mug of water to boiling, then take it from the


- add the seed powder and juice of 1/2 - 1 lemon and as much sugar

as you like to

the hot water and stir well

- let it brew for ±30 min - ready! (it's not necessary to filter the

tea, the seed povder sets down after a time completely and the tea

becomes a clear liquid)

If needed, make more tea, you can keep it in the fridge for several



Subsumed, the tea couldn't break the cycle once the latter was fully

established, but it seems that it could have impeded the occurrence

of a new cycle at a very low dose - tea from 2 - 3 seeds once a

month can probably do the trick..."


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That is cool Bobb, I haven't used any tea just soaked in water and a small amount of lemon juice for 12 hours (RC seeds so a lot more than 2) and drank the mixture up sludge and all. The tea sounds a little more genteel, still doesn't sound like a sput though. Can you grind say 10 RC seeds up and place under the tongue for maintenance instead of a full dose?

And yes tingeling you are the kid, one's man paper is another man's (or in your case Woman's) blotter.

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Can you grind say 10 RC seeds up and place under the tongue for maintenance instead of a full dose?

Although I've never done it, I seem to remember some trying seed sputs in the past.  If you can put up with the taste, I don't see how it could hurt to try.  I think that sputs (whether mushie or seed) are mainly used as aborts, rather than prevents, though I, and others have used them as such when flying.

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Ten seeds might be a little much to hold under the tongue. I'm thinking more about 4 or 5. Like Bobb says, the idea is to abort a hit.

Sputs aren't meant to prevent a cycle. They are more for helping you through post dose hits. Or maybe avoid a hit when you are in an inconvenient place and have nothing else to help.

BTW, I have kept the sludge around in the fridge after I dosed and used a tiny bit as a sput.

Most my experiences with sputs are with mushrooms. A tiny piece under the tongue for about 20 minutes. Some times I have fallen asleep that way. The blue stain is hard to get out of the white pillowcase.   Leslie

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I have used crushed seeds as a sput and recall it being very helpful.  Wasn't sure if it would work will using medicines.  Or while detoxing.  Thought it might come in handy as I have enjoyed the last few nights rest. 

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Since Friday afternoon, I have had a constant shadow that elevates at times through the day.  Nothing seems to get rid of it.  Have used trex, 02, red bulls, sputs, capcasin spray.  Nothing provides any signifigant relief.  Always comes racing back and angrier then when it left.  It is extremely vascular in that I can locate veins throughtout my head where it hurts.

Gave up on the preventative meds after Friday.  Due to trex, can't dose till Thursday at best.  That's if I can hold off till then. 

Any suggestions?  Anything that I haven't tried?????

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Right now your body is going through a shock state. Your probably going to have to ride it out. The pred will do that. Did you taper off it? If not, you could be going into adrenal shock. If you start going into DT's, get to the hospital! If I was a betting man, I would guess that the pred just made your cycle that much worse. It's bad shit dude. It always ends the same. I've seen it over and over and over. You might want to go to the ER just in case.

Mad6string :-/

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Between stopping some meds and loading up on others, it's not surprising that you're stuck in a headache rut.

Hopefully you did taper off the prednisone, but even tapering off can land you where you are headache-wise.

You shouldn't mix imitrex and "sputs" as they both increase serotonin levels so be careful. also, using small doses of any of the psychedelics as "SPUTS" will have an effect on the next full dose and block it at least partially.

I know how it is when you want to grab anything available to stop the pain but sometimes less is more.

I've had those all day bangers where nothing works. At that point I would take a couple aspirin (Excedrin Migraine) and tried to sleep it off. I would suggest nothing but 02 until it breaks....and it WILL break.

As Mad6string said, if you stopped a large or long term prednisone regimen cold turkey, that is not good. It has to be tapered or the doc has to give you a shot to restart your adrenal gland.

Just a reminder to everyone....

Always discuss stopping or starting any medications with your doctor.


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I had taken three days worth of pred at 60mg and one day worth at 50mg.  Then stopped.  Four or five nights of 500mg depakote and stopped.  Right now, it almost feels as if it is not CH.  The only similar trait is the cyclical like spikes every few hours.  Other then that it feels as if the vessels on my left side are ready to pop.  And my pupil dilation on that side is like a pulse.  Also, the pain is constant but has a pulse like quality.  Very strange.

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Sounds like adrenal shock to me. Pred. suppresses the adrenal glands, that's why the doctors have you taper off it. It gives your glands a chance to start producing again. You might have to start on it again and taper off it the right way. You can't just stop taking that stuff. Your body will freak out. That's what's happening to you. You are on all these meds and they all have an adverse affect on your body. So, when you just stop, your body has to figure out what happened to all the man made chemicals that took place of the ones it normally makes on it's own and adjust accordingly. You now have a chemical deficiency. Dopamine and adrenaline do a lot of things. If your body is not releasing them at the right amount, you feel like shit. Hence the shadows and cluster hits.


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You need to talk with you doctor as soon as possible. You have to taper off all these medicines, I would think. I know for a fact you have to with pred. That's why they prescribe you a prednizone TAPER!! You can't just stop taking it. It will fudge you up!

Sorry to be so blunt.


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Does everyone recommend going back on the prednisone?

If it was me in your position, I think that is what I would do, and then taper off of it.

Listen to Mad6string.  He has been through all of this.  He went into adrenal shock when he tried to taper off of the pred too quickly.  It damn near killed him.  He had been taking the pred for quite a while, but still, prednisone is nothing to mess with.  It should always be tapered. 

My two cents,


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Never stop that treatment on a big dose, and sudden stop.... It can be very unpleasent taking pred, but even so, never stop it right away, ever. Unless doctor tells you to.

cyclical like spikes every few hours.Other then that it feels as if the vessels on my left side are ready to pop.And my pupil dilation on that side is like a pulse

I had this you describe here. I had it while using pred. It camouflaged pain, but not all of it. The result was that i felt it didn`t come "trough", and there was pressure building up as days went. But i dont know for sure, just the way i felt. Because of that, it got constant.

As doses got smaller, the pressure and CH became as usual.

Good luck to you, i hope you feel better today.

Wishing you the best :)

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Okay, back on the pred at 50mg as of this morning, neck is not as bad as it was and based on the flushed face I can tell the pred is around.  The pulsating aches have ebbed as well to a minor background annoyance.  Hopefully I can taper correctly and get back to living life.  Thanks for everyones well wishes and concerns!!!

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Thanks Dave and Tingleing.  Actuially having a pretty solid day.  Went vack to the pred taper as of this morning and even before I did I had a feeling that things were changing.  The "puose" has mellowed to an ocassional reminder of this weekend.  My head has been clearer then it has been in days and no need for 02 all day.  Go figure.  Maybe I shocked it into something else or maybe the pred is working or maybe two moons collided.  Don't care right this minute, just hoping for a solid sleep.   

It just hit me as I was typing that maybe, just maybe, it was all the positive vibes I was receiving.  Hey, you never know 8-)

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