spiny

Don't ya hate those rogue hits? Kinda like 'where the hell did you come from'? > But, still a whole lot better than where you were a few months ago, right? 8-)

tucker, Add an energy drink or coffee to that O2! I have gotten to where I can suck down a cuppa joe in about 10 seconds. You could probably do an energy drink about as fast. Grab it on the way to the tank! The dual approach really helps me with the 'hair rippers'. 8-) And yes, I think we all go for that 'it isn't that bad' thing. : At least a few dozen times in my house! Pretty stubborn I am. Keep posting dude, we will keep talking. Being able to post about something no one else gets is a real life saver. That's why people hang around even when they are PF. PF thoughts for you. Sorry it is going so rough right now. :'(

Mrsg, Glad you are doing so much better!!! It is encouraging to everyone. 8-) 8-) I've been wondering what was up. Lil guy doing better too? I certainly hope so.

I'm sure that if she 'develops' an infection she will tell them off for giving it to her!!!!!!! : Honestly Kage, thanks for the update. I miss her posts and look forward to seeing her back on here soon.

I am so sorry she had to go back. All the best and may she not have any more problems!!!!!

I find cats to be particularly intuitive. Mine knows when I am having a rotten time. He stays with me. When I can finally lie down, he piles up on a spare pillow and purrs. Not his normal demanding self - just purrs. Bet he would want to play 'cat fishing' if I was busting!!!! 8-) 8-)

Yes! I agree, start a new thread. 8-) 8-) Obviously I had a rough night, I just had to correct a typo 'cause it said 'shart' instead of 'start'. :-[

YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH :) :) :) Determination pays off girl! 8-)

Wonderful news Kagemorou! :) :) I'm sure that she will keep them on their toes. Anyone heading her way with Nitroglycerin better duck! 8-) Give her our love. spiny

Wasn't around for this post. If you still need help, I use Firefox spiny

Tucker, Carry on!!! Sounds like you have run the 'shut the door' portion and are ready for another go. May you have better and longer relief from this dose. It does get better, really.

Purple, I too have sworn off posting on two occasions. Either I posted something not well received, hurt someones feelings, or read over it later and saw that I picked an 'in-appropriate' response. But, now I am so involved that my stopping is bad for my head!! Somehow it has become important to me to post what little help that I actually can supply. : Actually, this thread was one I swore off of after my initial post!!!! But, I got involved again, for better or worse. At least you can post links! And quotes! 8-) I am still at 'spell check' grade level and spend an inordinate amount of time correcting everything via 'preview'. This affliction is isolating and hunger for some social interaction can become overpowering. That hunger makes validation more important I think. Bottom line, you have been here for less time and posted valuable info that I don't have time to look for and research, much less post. Keep up the good work! Help with my sometimes stupid questions is appreciated. They can be stupid, but they are not mindless. I am so sorry that you are once again in a bad place. I think you would have arrived there even without the 'test' run you did. My gut says you did nothing that would aggravate the dragon, he just said 'up yours' and carried on with his own agenda. He is very good at that and seems to be beating his own record for torture for many of us this year and last. spiny whose mind works in weird ways - when it works

"If you are experiencing increased activity on the third day after dosing, my guess would be that the "tolerance" period of your receptors is ending -- that your personal "no way to get high" window is around three or four days. Your receptors are going through their transition from their "stoned" state to their "ready to get stoned once again" state." This is the closing statement on the link CHF posted on page 2 of this thread. "WWW. clusterbusters.com/theory.html. More mud, but the water is clearing somewhat. 8-)

Wow. A lot to digest here. Store seeds in freezer in mason jar I have read. Start at 10 or 30 I have read. Soak in water or alcohol or lemon juice I have read. Will get a good nights sleep I have read. Wait 2 to 5 days also read. Frozen seeds, sealed well can last 2 years I have also read. Slapbacks for 2-3 days. What if they start 3-5 days later, not 2-3? What does that mean? Evidently most of it depends on your body and metabolism. I take that to mean that if you normally get by with less of other prescribed meds than other people need, you might need less. If you require more of stuff generally, you might need more. Start small and work up seems good advice. Say you can't take anything with speed in it cause you will bounce for 24-48 hours from one dose (script). One Valium or Thorazine works well for you. Seems like that would mean your are oversensitive to 'uppers' and under sensitive to 'downers'. How sensitive does that make you to alt meds?What does that mean? Knowing your response to other meds should give you a clue where to start perhaps? But, if you are leery, start small to prevent anxiety based on new experience of new med? Slapbacks are common in the first 2-3 days. After a good nights sleep. What if there is not a 'good nights sleep'? So, you up the dose for the next time, right? But, things are no better and instead of relief after 3 days, TSHTF and you are worse off. Up it again and the same thing happens. Then what do you do? You take 5-6 doses,increasing each time, 5 days apart when you are totally detoxed and still not appreciably better, then what??? Shouldn't your weight figure into this as well? At 160lbs you might need 60-70. At 100lbs, that could be too many, right? Your metabolism is high, do you need more or less for your weight? High metabolism would process the med faster, so now what? Take more? How many doses do you take before you realize it isn't working? 3,5,9? Maybe your cycle is winding down, but dosing jacks it up again. Now what? The weather changes and you are back in HELL, now what? Questions running through my pea brain. :-[ Any answers or suggestions? spiny seeking answers for the confused :

I think Purple is on a good track. The cause and effect thing I mean. Also, with regards to Verap. dosing. However, sometimes the dose is started low, on purpose so that you take the least amount needed to control the CH. Or, because you already have low BP. Verap lowers your BP and your resting BP is lower than what is recorded at the Dr.'s. So, it drops when you sleep. Dr. may get a reading of 110/80. If you relax and take a few deep breaths before taking a reading, the result might be 90/70. 360mg gave me a resting BP of 80/60. A higher dose would have been hazardous. MRI and MRA are fairly common tests with CH from my reading and personal experience. Problem is, we would like for them to show something and usually they don't, which then confirms the CH apparently. > Also, with the $hitty weather patterns this year, folks have reported nastier than usual cycles!!!!!

REM: Does anyone remember the sleep deprivation studies done in the 60's and 70's? Ok, I'm old and I do. : Without sufficient REM you get a bit nuts!!!! Some will go a LOT nuts. We need it and without it our personality tends to change. Yeah, I get hit at the start of REM. The more deprived you are of REM, the sooner it starts after falling asleep. So, the longer this $hit goes on, the quicker it hits after falling asleep!!!!!! For some, EVERY time you fall asleep. So, when in the 4 per night phase, I sleep in a 'barca-lounger' that belongs to my husband. No lying down at all. The only way I get any sleep. Dreams would be welcome and hopefully will come soon. Sucks, doesn't it? >

All the best to 'there goes a kitty' from 'there goes a bunny'. 8-) We love her too and wish a speedy and safe recovery!!! Thanks for relaying the info! Keep us updated please.

Tucker, Seems that Melatonin is on the 'not sure' list. Benadryl seems to be on the 'ok' list. I take 20mg Melatonin. If I am getting hit 3-4 hard ones, I will take another 20mg several hours after the first dose. Currently, I take 2 Benadryl at bedtime and have 2 Melatonin 10mg waiting for if I wake and need it. Hopefully you are getting the proverbial 'slapbacks'. O2, caffeine and taurine, or coffee are good safe abortives. All the best!

;D ;D That is so awesome. Nothing as wonderful as the total surprise when you wake up and it is MORNINGÂ - not 2:00am. Keep grinning and ENJOY! 8-) 8-)

What Tuckerman said!!!!!! Have you tried coffee or energy drink at the start of one? Glad you got some O2! :D :D Great stuff. Get more! Sounds like you are getting there. 8-) 8-) You have a whole cheering team here. JEEZ! Tried to add a jumping smiley and they disappeared from the screen! It won't open now. So, guess ya will have to picture one!

No. But I am going to tell him that since he wouldn't RX O2, I am using welding O2. Bet he squirms. Also, when I tell him that I am still in cycle, he will ask "Why didn't you call?" Ah, because last time I had to fight, via your receptionist, to get short acting Verap, not the long acting $hit!!!! And you won't see me but twice a year and it is a 3 month wait!!!! : Mine is an idiot and I know it. But, the only one within 100 miles, so stuck I am. > But, now it is OK, cause I know more than he does! Oooooh: What a red face he would get if he knew I said THAT. ;D 8-) spiny

Tucker, Yes, you do want to breath hard at first. It helps focus your mind and alleviate the pain faster. I would do it for 15-20 breaths and then slow down to normal comfortable rate. Also, staying on for the same amount of time it took to stop the CH will help prevent a return of the beast in an hour. Melatonin rocks. It is cheap too. Really does help with night time hits. See, by starting your own thread, you have received a lot of support!!!! 8-) 8-) All the best and stay safe, spiny

CHF is right. Diltiazem is also one of those 'let's try this since the Verap is a problem' that a Neuro will give you for CH as well. Like Verap, it lowers BP too. So in essence you were taking two meds that lower BP. I had to taper of off it 'cause you should not just stop taking either overnight. If it is one you can't eliminate, it does function like Verap and would probably have the same effects. That doesn't mean you can't use alt. meds. if you still need it. If you are in the market for a new O2 set-up, Lifegas is a good one. You need to order one with a 'barb' for the Optimask. The barb accepts the tubing from the mask. The DSS (?) outlet is for an on demand mask or other setup. They cost about 55.00 delivered. The mask is about 28.00. Those guys know the necessity of getting it to you right away and ship immediately The jury rigged setup will get you through till the other items arrive. Since you are in detox, you don't want to go without your O2 if it works. You do want to make sure that you get a high enough flow. 8-) All the best.

Tucker, Someone else will be here soon to help you with your seed questions. Sorry I was not a help there. Just got you started on the basics and how to cope in between. Hang in there!

Tucker, Welcome. You came to the BEST place. You can use a plastic bag to get more O2. You put the tube in and tape around it for a seal. Then tape the mask to another hole. Seal the original opening. Let the bag fill up partially, like a good bit. Then breath from your mask. You will be drawing from the large bag, not the tubing, so you can get a higher flow that way. If you don't have tubing you can tape to the threads. I would not use a 'scented' one, but a tall kitchen bag would work. Just seal all the openings so you don't lose your O2. Beats 8LPM. Breathing: Breath in deeply and exhale hard. I think of a beach ball. Expand your lungs all around. Exhale with force to make all the room you can for the O2. Hyperventilate (easy when ya hurt!). Once the pain is gone, continue with the O2 for the same amount of time or number of breaths it took to get rid of the beast. This is important, it helps prevent a return visit in short order. I find it the hardest part too. I don't hurt anymore, so I want to split. Use coffee or Monster or another energy drink at the first sign of an attack to abort. Use the O2 at the if the drink doesn't kill it. I start the coffee and then hit the O2 while it makes. With energy drink, it's your choice of which to do first. Do you take Melatonin at night? It helps a lot of people. Some take 6mg and others a lot more. I use 20-30mg at bedtime. 10mg and I wake up in an hour. Anyway, it helps with the nighttime hits. Are you taking Verapamil or Lithium? You need to detox from those as well. You might want to get a good O2 set up too. We can help there too. It is your best defense. 8-) spiny