new comer HELP NEEDED!

[jkandola319]

hey,

i have been diagnosed with cluster migraines for about 7 years nowÂ…i have been recently diagnosed with chronic headaches, it has now been about 4 months with migraines almost everydayÂ…i am currently on verapamil and take take zomaig nasal spray or imitrex injections for attacksÂ…I am writing this post hoping someone can help me with using shrooms to put a end to this..I live in Vancouver Canada and can access shrooms thru a friend but i am a little weary as i do not know what kind of strain it will be..also i do not know much about dosage and how often to take themÂ…pleeeeeeeaaasssee heeeelllpp!

[Bejeeber]

Hey jkandola,

can access shrooms thru a friend

Well that tends to be the main vitamin M busting hurdle right there, and you've already cleared it, so you're ahead of the game.  8-)

i am a little weary as i do not know what kind of strain it will be..

When the strain subject comes up, what I've seen so far is a consensus that the strain doesn't tend to make a big difference, so feggedaboudit.

also i do not know much about dosage and how often to take themÂ…

Anywhere from 1 to 2g dry powder is pretty standard, as is spacing the doses 5 days apart. Also (brace yourself - this is the bad news) ya gotta make sure you haven't taken any blocking meds for 5 days or so before a bust. Blocking meds include zomig and imitrex dammit.  Ugh, yeah so you may wanna look into high flow 100% O2 for aborting attacks while you're detoxing (it appears that verapamil may interfere with busting some, but not totally block it - some headbangers have busted while on verap with pretty good results, enough to then go completely off the verap and finish the busting job).

If you haven't experienced the vit M before, it's of course important to read the warnings on who shouldn't mess with it....

https://clusterbusters.org/?page_id=236

....and to realize that you could be tripping pretty good there for 6 hours.

Here's some O2 info:

https://clusterbusters.org/?page_id=77

I bet you're about to revolutionize your cluster migraine experience.....fingers crossed that we'll hear back from you about a successful bust, and a life regained.  8-)

[MoxieGirl]

Hi jkandola,

I shall give you the standard Cluster Busters greeting - welcome to the board, and sorry you are here.

When I came to this site for help I needed about 6 weeks to wean myself off of the Topiramate I was taking before I could bust. I spent that time pouring over the posts in the ClusterBuster Files section. The pinned posts at the top mostly.

https://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?board=files

There is a wealth of information in there.

In addition, we are always happy to answer questions and help when we can. So ask if you have questions.

I had never used mushrooms before busting and was really nervous. I started with a 1.2 gram dose of dried chopped mushrooms, soaked in peppermint tea for 10-15 minutes. This gives the tea time enough to cool so you can drink it right down and the psilocybin time to be absorbed. I also add a bit of lemon and honey to my tea. The lemon helps the Psilo break down and the honey helps with the taste.

Personally, I have found a difference with different strains of shrooms. Not in regards of effectiveness, but in allergic reaction. Some strains make me itch like crazy for about 20 minutes. But other than that, the strain doesn't seem to matter much.

I'd also suggest you find out all you can on using O2. This is generally accepted as the first option when it comes to aborting an attack, and if set up right can be very effective.

Also, have a cold energy drink on hand, such as Red Bull, and or coffee. This also helps a lot of people abort.

Good luck,

MG

[Tony Only]

Sorry you found us but good for you that you did.

Pretty much nothing to add to wonderful advices above except Liquorice Root perhaps (if you manage to get rid of the medications at some point). My busting is married with the Herbal Protocol. http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1322547210 and https://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1298659068

[smiley=engel017.gif]

[jkandola319]

thanks alot for all the help!!!

so if i want to start the vit m...I will have to be off my zomaig and imitrex for 5 days????...I have tried in the past to taper off the verapamil and i started getting 2-5 migraines a day..i doont think i can try to taper off the verapamil....I have used o2 in the past and found it was only helpful in the early stages of an attack..like the first two mins..I also think i did not have the correct mask.. i used a sandard one that looks like a cup over my mouth and nose...i am glad to hear that the vit m i found thru a friend will work.. I will be getting it today...from reading the threads above this is the understanding i got..and please give your input.

1. I got the vit m

2. o2 tank with proper mask

3. redbull

4. 1-2 grams every 5 days (for how long?)***with no zomaig or imitrex (dont know how ima do this)***

5. research Liquorice Root

thanks again for all the help..its nice to hear from ppl that know what im going thru.

[Tony Only]

Around 5 days yes. Triptans (Zomig & Imitrex) will block, see Shutting The Door. The 5 days detox is usually pretty rough for us and it needs to continue if one keeps on busting. Oxygen is by far the best weapon to use during this time. Most just need to try out different ways to use it to get the maximum helping potential out of it before heading to detox road. I'd say you need to have O2 working for you in such a way that you can abort every attack with it in 5-20 minutes. High flow oxygen (25lpm and up) is the most usual way with proper mask. I used the same regular mask that you have and it was enough, I just sealed it to the extreme and modified it to deliver more O2 to my pain side nostril. Most people use more "pro" masks though, I will add links below. Don't worry, you are heading to pain free life; get O2 gear to work for you, stock up on those energy drinks and bust every 5 days so long that cluster headaches are completely terminated. After 5 days off the meds you can even add the Liquorice Root and Skull Cap. Wishing you all the best.

Cluster Headache mask

http://headachemasters.com/

ClusterO2 Kit

http://www.clusterheadaches.com/ccp8/index.php?app=ecom&ns=prodshow&ref=o2ptimask

[Purple]

welcome to Clusterbusters jkandola, sorry you have to be here, but luckily you are

I was going to answer you last night but Jeebs did before me.

I think you should know that the Clusterbuster method is not always magic, but sometimes it is.

It's clear to me now that preventive treatments with psilocybin, LSD or LSA works to avoid cycles, but if you're in the middle of a cycle when you start to bust, it might not be that magic... but it could.

Well, you're chronic... but I  fell on a post by a long time user the other day who I hadn't heard of for a while (Tingeling). So I checked her last posts (posted 12 months ago) and... she's cured, and that's why I didn't hear about her for a while. I could barely believe that she was completely CH free now: she was so bad a chronic clusterhead, her life completely messed. She says that busting every month for years finally got completely rid of her CH and she now have a new life. She used a (her own) mix of LSA containing seeds and MM...

So certainly, yes, the busting method works, but it's not necessarely an easy fight, especially if you're chronic.

But all those meds you're taking right now are very nasty, and no doubt the best road is here.

Good luck and don't hesitate to post any questionning you have.

About quantities, opinions differ on that matter, and I guess it's because we are all unique... and have different reactions... I don't know. Personnally, for MM, I  took so far from 1 gram to 1,5 grams (dry of course), for RC seeds, I took up to 200 (with very little psych effect), and LSD, well... you never know how much LSD you take anyways unless you know the chemist who made it... even then. Some claim MM is the best busting substance, some say it's LSD, and I think that LSA is probably as effective, if not more (and without psych effect)

[Purple]

I have tried in the past to taper off the verapamil and i started getting 2-5 migraines a day..i doont think i can try to taper off the verapamil....

I think some have busted while still on Verapamil... Anyone on this?

Zomig and Sumatriptan are based on the same kind of product than LSD/psilocybin/LSA, triptans, that is. So for sure, these products interfere with busting.

Yes, the 5 days detox is Hell time, most here have been through that. Lots of coffee/energy drinks, properly set oxygen kit and ice (for me) or heat (for others) will help you get through this hell.

But these meds are killing you, and actually they are bringing more headaches, more CH... You'll feel better after you detoxed.

[CHfather]

great advice you've received from this great community.  i'm just affirming it, really. [and i see that 3 more excellent posts got in while i was composing mine, so i'm even more redundant now]

as jeebs said, many people have found that verapamil doesn't completely block busting (or maybe doesn't block it at all).  how much are you taking?

O2 is your best bet.  after you've read that document that jeebs linked you to, let us know where you stand with O2 (do you have the right mask; are you using it properly; what flow rate do you have...?)

while redbull is the right "generic" name for energy drinks, many people like the ones that are stronger--higher in caffeine and taurine.  some Monster and RockStar brand drinks have a lot more caffeine than a redbull, and even some "energy shots" (the 3-ounce bottles) have more.  i think jeebs likes 6-Hour Power for his attacks.  red bull has about 80mg of caffeine (roughly a cup of coffee's worth)--you can see some comparisons at this page: http://www.caffeineinformer.com/caffeine-content/red-bull

[jkandola319]

i cant thank all of you enough for all this info.

I am currently taking 120mg verapamil (4-6 pills/day 480mg-720mg/day).

I will be getting my 02 tank asap.

Tony Only : what are these Liquorice Root and Skull Cap you speak of...sorry im at work and cant read up on it (will read on it tonight) but am curious to hear the short version.

Well as soon as i get my O2 tank and flat of energy drinks i will begin my 5 days of hell..wish me luck..then i will begin my vit m......after the 5 days and the vit m dose can i take zomaig or imitrex if i am still getting these crap headaces???

Thanks again..will keep you posted

[alleyoop]

I think some have busted while still on Verapamil... Anyone on this?

I have been on 480mg daily of verap for 12-13 yrs now.  I was diagnosed CCH in 2001 after a year of misdiagnosis and unneeded surgery.   Verapamil was the first thing my neuro tried, and of all of the many meds that I later took, the only one that gave me moderate relief.

When I found Clusterbusters in '02, I began busting my h/a's with MM.  It took about 4 to 5 yrs and other regimens to go episodic, but that's what I eventually did.  In the meantime, the relief that busting gave me was significant, both in frequency and intensity of the attacks.  I was taking 480 mg of verap daily though all this, and still am.

jk, you have some really knowledgeable peeps giving you some excellent advice.  Get your 02 set-up going, get off the triptans, and start busting.  Keep taking the verap, at least for now.  I think, especially with the migraines, that you will be amazed at the difference in your life even 6 mos from now.

Good luck!  And keep asking questions, you're getting great advice.

Bobb

[Bejeeber]

i think jeebs likes 6-Hour Power for his attacks.

Yes that's right I've reported using and liking them for aborting low level hits/shadows, and the wife has aborted many a migraine with them, but I should probably just mention that I don't know if anyone in a full blown cycle has reported trying them for impending high level CH hits. The Monster and RockStar CHf mentions have been more battle tested in that heavy beast combat kind of way.

OK enough of my cluttering the place up with that trivia - it's undoubdtedly a tuff thing to get your head around detoxing from the triptans, jkan, but glad to see how this most excellent community has come together to advise ya so well here.

Maybe you can think of this process in a one step at a time low risk sort of way, where first you get that "power user" O2 rig together, then with your triptans by your side for back up, you can give the high LPM 100% O2 a try. Once you've proven to yourself that it can supplant the triptans you could start the detox.

Hey Purple, yes, fortunately I have seen and heard specific reports form CH'ers who have been able to bust while on verap. One striking case I can think of right off is from one of the members here who like Tingeling was indeed CHRONIC. After getting siginficant CH reduction from busting, he was able to go off the verap and put the nail in the beast's coffin. Last I heard he's been CH free for a LONG time, Chronic no more.  8-) He does also credit the D3 regimen, which I think he started after going off the verap, with his success. I'm not specifically naming him because I don't know that going completely public about busting is his thing, plus you never know when I might get the details of someone's story unintentionally skewed. 

[CHfather]

after the 5 days and the vit m dose can i take zomaig or imitrex if i am still getting these crap headaces???

well, as someone said, you're probably still going to be getting attacks after one dose. you might have a miracle, some people do, but usually it takes several doses.  if you do take zomig or imitrex, you'll be advised to wait five more days.  you really can't do both.  our hope is that with effective O2, maybe with energy drinks helping, and the verap (probably at no more than 480, and preferably less), you'll be able to stay the course. 

since tony is in a very different time zone, i'll just mention that the licorice root extract is something you can get in most health food/organic market-type stores (and, of course, over the internet).  it's not something to be messed with (like psychedelics), so you need to read the file and the warnings, particularly related to blood pressure.  but it has helped some folks very quickly.

i don't think anyone has mentioned the vitamin d3 regimen, which has helped lots and lots of people and is generally very safe and inexpensive.  when you get home, you should also read this file: https://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1314134804

[jkandola319]

Thanks again people....I feel alot more confident now then i did a few days ago..I got alot of reading to do...and will follow up soon.

Jason

[jkandola319]

oh and keep the info coming...very helpful 

[jkandola319]

as for the energy drinks..am i looking for something that is high in taurine or high in caffeine...or just high in both???. I have read of taurine helping with bouts but not caffeine

[MoxieGirl]

Hi,

Looks like you are getting a lot of fantastic advice from the wonderful people here.

I wanted to clear one thing up. I've seen the term 'cluster migraines' used off and on by different people on different boards. I think there is a misunderstanding, or miss-diagnosis or wrong terminology out there amongst some doctors who think Clusters are a form of Migraine.

They aren't. In fact, far from it in my opinion.

I think it's also safe to say that most cluster heads hate the medical term 'Cluster Headaches' (which is the correct term). In my opinion, the word 'headaches' and/or 'migraines' diminishes what they actually are. I much prefer 'Cluster Attacks'. But, let's not get side tracked on what we should or shouldn't call them, as there are already a number of threads on that topic.

What confuses me is that you mentioned you got 2-5 "migraines" a day the last time you tried to come off Verapamil. Now, was that migraines or cluster attacks?

On the topic of being Chronic, I've been chronic 7 years, ever since the beast started attacking me. At my worst point I was getting up to 5 attacks a day, every 2-3 days. That's when I started busting.

Since busting, I've had pain free periods stretching to 23 days, which is AMAZING! But, I'm still technically chronic after 2 years of busting off and on. And I think that has been my downfall, off and on. Because of a number of factors, I haven't been able to bust weekly, or even monthly, for more than a few months at a time.

Life is 1000 times better than it was 2 years ago, but I'm not pain free (yet).

On the plus side, my migraines (migraines, not clusters) have dropped from 40+ a year to less than 10.

Busting has saved my life, but like others have said, don't bank on it being a miracle cure. This beast is a tough one to kill.

Hang in there.

MG

[jkandola319]

Hey MG,

when i came off the verapamil i got 2-5 cluster attacks a day. I dont really get normal migraines or headaces often..just cluster attacks.

when i started documenting my attacks around 5 years ago i would get attacks in episodes...usually lasting about a month..but recently my attacks started September 2013 and hasnt stopped..thats when my neuro told me he thinks i have switched to chronic..i really hope hes wrong. but this is the longest episode i have ever had. I have been averaging one attack a day since September.

Thanks again for all the great information

[CHfather]

as for the energy drinks..am i looking for something that is high in taurine or high in caffeine...or just high in both???. I have read of taurine helping with bouts but not caffeine 

there doesn't seem to be much question that caffeine helps for most people.  some just do a strong cup of coffee.  so high in caffeine is important.  the taurine seems to be a benefit, but i don't think that's been shown conclusively (and i don't know of anyone who uses just taurine and gets results).  so i'd say high caffeine is most important, and if you can get high caffeine + high taurine, that might be best.

[Tony Only]

Liquorice Root is one the most powerful herbs on the planet and according to Les' protocol it addresses our faulty hypothalamus and the chemical imbalance we have going on in HPA axis. It is very efficient for many. I will not do you a favour by writing up a short version but you will do yourself a favour by reading the Herbal Protocol, even by bit by bit since it's a lengthy article. Les covers so many different important aspects in it that Protocol really needs to be understood. Wishing you a great journey

http://www.clusterheadaches.com/cb/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1322547210

[Bejeeber]

my attacks started September 2013

Ah haaaa, I'm guessing (and hoping) you may still be right, that it could be a particularly long cycle of the episodic variety, not a definite chronic thing yet you got going on there.

[jkandola319]

great thanks again. i will read more in depth.

I had another question reagarding the o2 tanks. I called my supplier which i used in the past with only 10lpm (which i now know isnt enough lpm). I explained them i need something with 25lpm and up and she said that is really high and that i would go thru a 2 litre tank really fast..is this normal? do you guys go thru tanks fast? or is there a special tank i can get?

[jkandola319]

i really hope so too Bejeeber.

[ThatHurtsMyHead]

Jason,

Great to see all the posts on your thread!!   This group of people are like no other in the WORLD...   Everyone here cares to our core.

Regarding your O2 question:  Yes at 25lpm a medical "E" tank doesn't last very long.  I use a 15lpm valve wide open and can usually get 2ea 30 minute attacks out of one.  Here's a great little O2 calculator:  (most O2 tanks are filled to either 2,000 or 2,200 psi)

http://www.medfixation.com/oxygen-cylinder-tank-calculation/

What many get is a few "E" tanks (one to keep in the car) and a rather larger "M" tank for home.  The M tank uses a dolly to move and is approx equilavent to 4 "E" tanks.

You're on the journey to a new and better life!  Don't think I've heard a single negative comment from anyone that's started on the path of vitamin M (mushrooms, fungus etc).

PFW,

J

[spiny]

jk,

Please don't let them make you think that you are now chronic!!!! I am ECH. But over time and from the meds my cycle went up to 7 months of the year. Just before Fall Equinox till a few weeks after the spring Equinox.

My hits were from 8pm till 6am. Four per night at 2.25 hours each. A 15 minute break between hits. But, I was still episodic. When this poop started kicking in on a regular basis, I had one per day and they lasted about three months. That was several years and a boatload of meds ago!!

With O2, I could kill the hit in 15-20 minutes, but not lie down or the next one would hit within its' normal 15 minutes. So, I learned to sit up in a recliner to wait for the next hit. At least I was not hurting during that time. Then I found out that a lot of folks with night time hits sleep in a recliner. Go figure. 

Stay the course and regain your life!!!!!! This whole board is pulling for you!

all the best,

spiny